While social sciences are a useful tool, you perfectly demonstrate how they can be used as a convenient tool to outlaw deranging opinions and lifestyles by justifying the move by supposed facts. And he would sometimes spout off this genteel junk about how men should be nice to ladies. Its the word of God: I think its reasonable to suggest that people choosing this lifestyle put much more thinking into their relationships and are more intellectually alert than the average person going the default way. Youve also been influenced by perverse secular culture. Its not called beatings or abuse, which is what it is. - . And why do that one, and not the other, need it? Instead, they wanted to know what I had done wrong to need to be punished and felt that I had abandoned my wedding vows when I left him. If accusations of anger are routinely hurled as thought stoppers by Christian tyrants everywhere, just think how effective wolf must think it will have been to accuse you of rage. Did you hear of anyone else going through the same thing? Period. As a man and a Christian myself, I think all Christians need to listen to these stories. [redacted], and his wife, [redacted], were in the room while I was talking with [redacted]. Those laws included things that happened in the bedroom between consenting adults. Not a single male rose to my defense. Good for them? Thats in the Bible. She will need to learn some self-control with not crying out, or bite a pillow to keep quiet. States have laws restricting what people in a position of influence can do with those they employ or counsel or pastor or treat. Our families, and some of our friends think we are nuts, me mostly, for living this way, but I can honestly say that the 10 years of our marriage I am most happy knowing that I can at any moment end up crying with a sore bottom over my husbands lap. My reaction then was much like most women and like the worlds view of submission. You get all edgy. Make sure that everything you support is not flushed down the toilet because of arrogance, intolerance and a misplaced desire for controlling peoples lives. As for Daisy putting a link to a feminist website, again, my point is made. I got spanked as a child and so did my brother and we turned out great! campaign, Christian Domestic Discipline/Loving Wife Spanking in a Christian Marriage is not satire -- and I just can't get it out of my head. Im about the only one here who actually quotes scripture. When you said, I wanted to know how did Lauren get from the point where wife spanking was considered normal to the place where she said, THIS IS WRONG it is ABUSE!. As a society have always restricted what two consenting adults can do. Certain things like really bad attitude, yelling at anyone in the house, throwing a fit when mad, or being disrespectful (especially in front of others) will all add up to a bad whippin after a while. Yes, guys, best leave 100PinkApples raging away because it suits your purpose better to have her stay unforgiving and bitter. _50 SHADES OF GREY AND PATRIARCHY: WHAT EXACTLY DID WE EXPECT?_. Comfortable, but very childish, very full coverage stuff. How did you finally put it all together that wife spanking was wrong? Didnt the APA decide homosexuality is just fine? You are a very dogmatic person. Its not just me that talks about your husband having authority, Julie Anne. The Bible keeps the door firmly shut on what goes on in the marital bedroom and so should you. [redacted] said in a counseling session Jamin has admitted to using anger as a teaching tool for [redacted] like you would train a dog. Just to give one example of an alternate interpretation: I understand the phrase he shall rule over thee as a description of one outcome of the Fall, not as a command that would restore things to their proper place. If it makes it hotter for them to mix in some faith? We use the Bible in our lessons. . I know this is true. One of our problems was that Ben wanted to go to his church, where they didnt believe in CDD, so we had no support system, but my pastor told me that I had to be submissive and that God would work all out in the end. His mother had passed away long ago and his father died shortly after our wedding and I never got to talk to him much. Webchristian domestic discipline; Corset Waist Training; Deep Thoughts; Exercise and Chocolate; Fiction; maintenance; marriage; my submissiveness; Orgasm Control; Pierced Nipples; Punishment; Spanking; Submission; swingers Nor, based on his presentation here, did it ever occur to me to just assume that Lone Voice is a Christian. Well, actually, to pray for abused women, even though we do not know who they are, is to accomplish much. Wife Spanking, Christian Domestic Discipline, Domestic Violence *** You husbands in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way, as with someone weaker, since she is a woman; and show her honor as a fellow heir of the grace of life, so that your prayers will not be hindered. I wouldnt say the link I gave was to a feminist site so much as it is a Christian egalitarian site, the two not being the same thing. I can see from your posts that you have major issues with men, but please dont filter the Bible through your own experiences. What you need to understand and accept is that people having this type of relationship proceed in a way closer to this scenario than the romantic date approach you imagine. He may try using a different name, or he may try some other such subterfuge, but he WILL be back. Advocating for women being in leadership is asking for equality and for what the Bible teaches; that is not feminism.. So if not understanding DD is not understanding justice then you are already acknowledging that DD is non-consensual. One wife got spanked because she was slow in getting dinner on the table when her husband came home from work. Ive been exploring submission for some time, and the one thing that I have discovered above anything else is the fact that wifely submission brings harmony to a home. I was hoping the article was good no to come out and say that all hitting, whether it is an adult or child, is assault, but I didnt see that. Hes made the right call. Do you find that you need it as much or less over the last 30 years? He warned me many times and told me to stop or I would regret it. Im also arguing that you continue to blow bullshit and try to make it sound like wisdom. There is no biblical support for your position repeatedly quoting Eph 5.22 and the like is not proof for your stance, because you interpret such passages incorrectly. In fact, if such anger is not expressed, it must be suppressedonly to come out sidewise at some unexpected time. General: Dont like scripture when it disagrees with your prejudices, you guys, do you? Thank you for writing and shedding light on another form of domestic abuse that doesnt get talked about very much. So when my husband spanked me the first time, I was embarrassed, but I thought maybe it was my fault or somehow it was OK. Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest you be like him yourself. How else can we understand what we havent gone through, or learn to avoid causing needless suffering to those around us? No wonder Lauren was so confused in her marriage. Women get to be slaves for men, while men lounge about reading their bibles trying to find bible verses that support their new sadistic fetishes to heap on their wives and children. It was very difficult because it was not like I had a black eye or bruises. And no, actually, they arent. Most wives cant be as obedient and submissive as God wants unless their Husbands are strict and are willing to give them spankings when they mess up. there is one kind of safety plan while the victim is still living with the abuser, and the plan gets modified when she leaves the abuser, and modified again when things alter significantly, such as if the abuser loses his job, if a court hearing is pending or has just happened, or when anything changes which might affect the risk for the victim. Except the exegeises you have been taught, does contradict. Professional, licensed counseling is recommended. If some of them change their mind at some point, this is ok, but their testimonies do not make the lifestyle an abuse. Similarly, abusing men need to be taken to task (no, I dont know how, and in some cases they just never will be) but the fact of their existence does not mean God was wrong to say that the man is the head of the wife and that he shall rule over thee. (I dont have much time or interest right now to go through and read all comments left to me since I last was here, or comment on them all.) What I can however say is that what you describe isnt generally speaking the spirit of domestic discipline. This practice is about two consenting adults who are free to leave the relationship at any time, period. You just posted most of my rapist and fathers favorite bible verses. God was saying that, in our post-paradisal state, spousal relationships would become much harder, in part because many men would be tempted to become abusive and domineering. As a matter of fact, I get yelled at on occasion by homosexual marriage supporters on other sites for politely stating I disagree with how homosexual marriage supporters bully those they disagree with over the homosexual marriage topic.). I had another thought about thetransfer of headship in marriage. Because of his behavior with no rage, just an expectancy of needing to control you, it makes me think this was normal within his background or upbringing. So the real question is, do you want to be shortsighted, or do you want to position the cause your serve in a way that will allow it to pass the test of time. I got support from friends and it was only when I opened up to them that they helped me see it was wrong. I grew up in a home that practiced CDD, my mom was no stranger to dads strap that he kept on a hook is his study. Dark child, your nickname tells me something about your view. Gen 2:23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. Michael is worried sick over his wife's whereabouts, and he's determined to put a stop to her irresponsible behavior. I do not agree with your philosophies and fixes, but I feel no drive or desire to label you as mentally sick. Are you serious? Here is my question to you: are you implying that the woman is a victim even if this situation and cannot truly consent? Did you know the APA approves gender reassignment surgery as the best way to HELP a male patient who reports his inner self is really female? When Jamin came home with a new laptop and never mentioned it to her she was trying to keep him accountable. We have a page for cybersafety in our Resources section too. I was sexually terrorized as a little girl by a bible loving, bible verse quoting, church going southern Baptist Christian man as a little girl. I would like to give a example: The husband asked the wife to wash the dishes she said tomorrow that resulted in a spanking. [redacted] said she has become numb to the abuse and did not feel scared, not like in the beginning. But when you seriously contend that there mere fact that our Lord appeared first to women and told them to tell the men negates the creation ordinance, Deborahs curse of wimpy Barak and the clear words of the Holy Spirit on this subject through the Apostle Paul, then I suggest you have really lost touch with the will of God. Like when my HOH was contemplating experimenting with our maintenance schedule. If you are currently living (or have lived) the Christian Domestic Discipline lifestyle and you would like to share how it has helped your marriage or relationship, please email your story and mention that you wish to share your experiences with other people. I got a terrible strapping, my behind was on fire when my husband put me in the corner. At first I couldnt believe that women were advocating being spanked by their husbands and submitting fully to their authority. Our opinions dont matter when our husbands spanks us. Go back to the word (Luke 4:1-13) and see for yourself. Any marriage in which one partner is exerting control over the other IMHO is wrong. Lone Voice said. The woman you are concerned about is indeed at very high risk. And I was told that since I was acting immaturely, this was the consequence. It is not because you happen to discover it now that it is new thing. Say for example, they are asked to bring another into the relationship/marriage bed, or commit a crime, because I have heard that from women. Yes, Its true. I am sorry, but that is beyond distasteful. I think he made his point. Im very grateful to Lauren for her e-mailand being willing to shed more light into this abusive practice so that we can have more understanding of what she and many others are going through. Women and little girls suffer through the pain and agony of pregnancy and childbirth. Michael is worried sick over his wife's whereabouts, and he's determined to put a stop to her irresponsible behavior. maybe a directory of churches and communities, that still get it, would help . What youre asking for is a form Benevolent Sexism. Right now, you have decided that you were morally better and intellectually superior to these people and that they are in need of medical care and social assistance which is quite an arrogant position to have for someone who admits not knowing much about the topic. You put it out there for me to read about, and Ill say something about it. To say that I consented to be spanked, or to say that even an adult woman consents to being spanked simply because she remains in that situation is to make a mockery of the word consent. saying she needs to feel the pain to remind her to whom she belongs and forcing her to do rigorous housework and chores. Its not just me that talks about your husband having authority, Julie Anne. Change), You are commenting using your Facebook account. If a man and a woman are not dating yet. Lydia00, Eph 5:21 does not contradict what follows., I agree. She has has been hospitalized many times due to his abuse but somehow he has used his position and influence to escape legal action each time. Finding resolve amidst the dissonance of "churchianity". Im so glad you found the strength to leave your abusive marriage. No wife who has ever been spanked by her husband submitted out of fear? On the one hand, they are too arbitrary (why should the age of consent be 15 and not 16 or 22, or even 30 especially since you suggest that even adults can be tricked into domestic discipline. Moreover, consent is tricky in these matters for a simple reason; many will consent to a humiliating or injurious act out of fear of losing their loverbut the Biblical reality is that the person, despite their consent, has just been injured or humiliated. Carry on. I soon found out that he was. photo credit: Chiara Cremaschi via photopin cc. Am I Enabling My Cheating Husbands Sin by Staying withHim? I debated putting this in the Godly ladies' thread but decided that I would risk my reputation to be thought of as forward because this is just too good to keep from men. My dad spanked me before I got married a lot but he doesnt really spank me much anymore but Ben said he can if he wants to. Did you even read the post? As a right wing, social conservative, I disagree with most secular left wing feminism. Now no one complains to the Pastor at Bible school anymore I can tell you. Daisy, I just quoted those verses. Gods judgments from Gen 3:14 3:17 set matters straight, and gave the man more work into the bargain. its called, http://lisasjoydd.blogspot.com. Update (12/28/15): previously, there were two YouTube videos posted of Dr. Phils showposted here. If Satan can keep you in the past, he will rob you of your future. It took a long time for me to have the strength to leave him. Do not strike faces or heads There might be an Ok, you know I want these things done and all week you have slacked off, you have until tomorrow (or tonight or whatever) and I will remind you if I have to, but he has never had to. Other times, my husband will listen, thank me for my input, but tell me that we are going to go with another answer. You are interpreting the Scriptures in error, just as the Pharisees did. christian domestic discipline A History of the Corporal Discipline of Women January 11, 2023 In this third and final part of my three-part series on Christian Domestic Discipline, we explore how the practice of domestic discipline continue through the middle-ages and even into America up until the mid-20th century. And make no mistake about it, any husband, pastor or other supposed Christian who claims the right to exercise coercive authority over another, excepting only to counter evil, is an abuser. I call it being a polite, persistent, pest. And then you call me a fool. Im over 40 years of age and in charge of my own life. So people actually choose to add their prefered dose of physical disciplining to leverage these psychological effects, it is an extra tool they use as part of their commitment to make things work with regards to the shared vision they have for their life (in which you have no business). I agree with that. What you got for American never married women over the age of 40, including ones who are not under their fathers care? Does the power differential matter? I disagree with you, but like Rock, I do not think that you are sick. I dont know what to do?!? YOU are calling domestic discipline justice. So: Do you see both yourself and your partner as people who need physical discipline? No this isnt the argument at all. The all knowing psychologist above is concerned with a relationship that infantilizes a woman. Me too. He/she was saying that men truly working with the wisdom of God understand everything, both Gods justice, and the theories of their counterparts, rather than only understanding their own theories and thinking that everybody else is a fool (like you do). Her perspective clarifies a lot. He wasnt hitting me with closed fists or objects. This is just like disciplining kids, just discipline. Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. But he never swore, or acted out of control. I believe the misogynists you identify are not Christians. I dont believe they are Christians. Finally, I would suggest that the fix you are suggesting are the reasons domestic discipline has been making a come back lately and is here to stay. Lets discusshymens. Wife Undermines Her Husbands Authority in Front of Children, He DisciplinesHer? Really, if you get off on spanking your wife (or are a wife who gets off on being spanked by her man), just chalk it up to your personal choice and stop trying to find biblical proof texts for it. Jamin then stated, I swear by anything, I did not grab her throat. I am a submissive wife but do not always submit. The criminal has relinquished consent by the act that requires justice. Sis has been married 3 times already, and bro is still married, but is miserable as his wife treats him the same as mom treats dad. Such as, not seeing them alone, only meeting in public, and if you need overnight accommodations to see them, NEVER stay at their place or let them stay at yours. When the man takes charge and makes really good, well-thought-out (and prayed for) decisions, its pretty easy for 2. She will need to learn some self-control with not crying out, or bite a pillow to keep quiet. So I would not use such laws as legitimate precedents for anything either. If more husbands would do this, we would have LESS divorces and better marriages. Dont want me sticking my nose into your bedroom affairs? Youre quoting a rule or law which only applied under the Old Covenant, for the Jews. But you dont know whether shes a Christian. The clip is just over one minute long: After reading Laurens letter and sharing back and forth e-mails, I had so many questions. We continue to call it abuse, despite the fact that it happens between two consenting* adults, and we continue to prosecute those teachers who abuse their students. He was seeking my input when I offered that this was his decision to make and I would just have to deal with it, and that he should just do what he thinks is best. If he loved his wife he would not want her to have sex against her will, if Christian men loved women they would not want them to have sex against their will. And then after that we will spend several articles looking at cultural views of domestic discipline in America before the modern age. I do not normally comment on web forums, but I wanted to counter-balance this thread. This perception betrays the fact that you are hating what you do not even understand. Did you get support from friends and family after leaving him? The call to statistics to justify that since it has to be abusive most of the time, it would be better to simply outlaw it. It was confusing because it felt no different than when I was at home. The one thing that surprised me was how happy all the married couples were. It is only going to increase as people go frustrated by the negative effects of domestic ideology on their happiness and increasingly get to the point of questioning everything. Part of me wishes this practice of wife spanking waslimited to just one denomination so it could be easierto expose, but it is clear from the above examples that we cannot. Jamin said he did not want to touch [redacted] who was still trying to sleep with her head on [redacted] left shoulder and [redacted] was just walking into his hand. As time went on, Ben became stricter and stricter with me, and my maintenance spankings have decreased from once a day, which lasted for over 6 months, to the now twice a week, Wednesday evening before our prayer meeting, and Sunday evening before Sunday bible study. Finally, Daisy be more Christ-like; keep your nose out of my bedroom.. Church youth group leaders would tell young ladies that modest is hottest and make it clear that exposing any kind of skin somehow made a woman loose or of a certain kind. My parents had total veto power over what I could wear. Just compare the divorce rates in 1960 with those of today. You do not need to agree with this practice, but you must be tolerant. Why? So thank you, from the bottom of my heart! However you and Anne, and all the other self-congratulating politically-correct thinkers in this thread are quite prompt to label other people mentally sick. They plan these relationships and there is no knowledge asymmetry. He can even be a bit bossy at times. Anderson saying, Its not common for someone to hurt themselves because theyre desperate for their husbands attention and their husbands not giving them the love they need and so they wack themselves. I wanted to thank you so much for all of your articles. I dont know where I have ever read such a torrent of self-satisfied sanctimony. And then to quote half of 1Cor 7:4! :o). Do not expect her to be silent through this experience though. I guess I fail to see how the one couple in the galaxy that can carry this on consensually should override the millions of women that are in domestically violent relationships. My bad experiences hardened me and now my marriage is helping me relax my rigid boundaries.I always said that I would never leave the city and here I am willingly becoming a country housewife. Mrs. Submission, christianforums.net, 10. This is your warning. Good intentions yield more good intentions. I was in such a relationship for a while. From what I can tell, Jamin remains a member in good standing at Doug Wilsons church. When I was a little girl, I was a quiet little sweetheart who was pleasing to be around. But the Pastor wouldnt agree with her that her husband was being too strict. Is it a Sin for a Christian Not to Live a HealthyLifestyle. Young girls will also learn from the behavior and may find themselves with abusive men because of familiarity. and gave the man more work into the bargain. There you will get a bit more info why I believe this is biblical. Just 3% of those (thats 0.1% of Americans) went to Africa and Eastern Europe isnt even mentioned: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/william-d-chalmers/the-great-american-passpo_b_1920287.html, Gary W: There is a judge and there is a criminal, the judge proclaims a sentence against the criminal which is carried out. This tendency you have to talk about people practicing it as if they were some sort of deranged people or animals inferior to you. Let me start at the beginning. I never forget the last time I tested him. IMO. Why are saddle-wearing men seen as free agents, capable of free thought, in direction of their own life? Finally, at the risk of getting my very own self consigned to the SSB Doghouse, who is this Lone Voice who comes around lecturing on forgiveness, especially when he gives every evidence of being the sort who is highly apt to provoke the very need forgivenessand that on an ongoing basis. I am in my early 30s and this past 4th of July I was there and we had a bit of an argument. If you get to the point were you are ready to prevent two contenting adults from living the way they choose, you are making a big disservice to any cause you pretend to serve. his God-given authority and actually lead.. I find your style offensive. I submit that every target of physically, emotionally or spiritually abusive behavior is our sister or brother, and that no perpetrator, absent real repentance, is to be embraced as family. It might not be terribly feminist to say so, but other women like feeling powerless during conjugal relations. WebThen I went to college and met my husband James, and became a Christian. Its happenin. DavidA Always portraying women as feeble-minded helpless victims is the worst kind of infantilization. For instance, those who practice domestic discipline often cite scripture that calls for wives to submit to their husbands. Thats a rule for ancient Israel, for young women still living at home with their fathers. I can remember being a little girl (probably middle school age) and hearing someone tell me the Scripture in Ephesians that calls women to submit to their husbands. They then work out a document, a 30-page document describing every aspect of the relationship (the superior/inferior nature and all its practical implications, when and how spanking is to be performed, what the man can and cannot do, what the woman can and cannot do etc).
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